Best strategy for building complex software?

LiveCode is the premier environment for creating multi-platform solutions for all major operating systems - Windows, Mac OS X, Linux, the Web, Server environments and Mobile platforms. Brand new to LiveCode? Welcome!

Moderators: Klaus, FourthWorld, heatherlaine, kevinmiller, robinmiller

stam
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 9:39 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: Best strategy for building complex software?

Post by stam » Wed Sep 30, 2020 3:33 pm

ghettocottage wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 2:33 pm
you can create a launcher file that you distribute to everyone, and have your main stack live on the server. When someone opens the launcher file it downloads the main stack and that is what they use.
Very cool idea... I’d have to host this external to my hospital but that shouldn’t be an issue with sensitive data as that will all be stored in LiveCloud with no data being stored in any device. And I recently got a personal LC server up & running, so will definitely pen this down for a future feature. But first I have to get the app up and running ;)

FourthWorld
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
Posts: 8421
Joined: Sat Apr 08, 2006 7:05 am
Location: Los Angeles
Contact:

Re: Best strategy for building complex software?

Post by FourthWorld » Wed Sep 30, 2020 6:05 pm

stam wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 3:33 pm
ghettocottage wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 2:33 pm
you can create a launcher file that you distribute to everyone, and have your main stack live on the server. When someone opens the launcher file it downloads the main stack and that is what they use.
Very cool idea... I’d have to host this external to my hospital but that shouldn’t be an issue with sensitive data as that will all be stored in LiveCloud with no data being stored in any device. And I recently got a personal LC server up & running, so will definitely pen this down for a future feature. But first I have to get the app up and running ;)
I rarely build any other way. It's a godsend, for my own development workflows and for customers who often see fixes and features delivered while we're on the phone, with no need to reinstall anything.
Richard Gaskin
LiveCode Community Liaison

LiveCode development, training, and consulting services: Fourth World Systems
LiveCode Group on Facebook
LiveCode Group on LinkedIn

SWEdeAndy
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
Posts: 61
Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2008 9:48 am
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Contact:

Re: Best strategy for building complex software?

Post by SWEdeAndy » Wed Sep 30, 2020 6:22 pm

FourthWorld wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 6:05 pm
stam wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 3:33 pm
ghettocottage wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 2:33 pm
you can create a launcher file that you distribute to everyone, and have your main stack live on the server. When someone opens the launcher file it downloads the main stack and that is what they use.
Very cool idea... I’d have to host this external to my hospital but that shouldn’t be an issue with sensitive data as that will all be stored in LiveCloud with no data being stored in any device. And I recently got a personal LC server up & running, so will definitely pen this down for a future feature. But first I have to get the app up and running ;)
I rarely build any other way. It's a godsend, for my own development workflows and for customers who often see fixes and features delivered while we're on the phone, with no need to reinstall anything.
I'd like to move more into this kind of approach. But – does Apple approve such apps for the AppStore? As far as I understand, you could later deliver a completely different 'inside app' from the one Apple reviews.
Andreas Bergendal
Independent app and system developer
WhenInSpace: https://wheninspace.se

stam
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 9:39 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: Best strategy for building complex software?

Post by stam » Wed Sep 30, 2020 8:15 pm

SWEdeAndy wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 6:22 pm
I'd like to move more into this kind of approach. But – does Apple approve such apps for the AppStore? As far as I understand, you could later deliver a completely different 'inside app' from the one Apple reviews.
Not sure, but there is probably some wriggle room - i say this because there are a number of games on the apple stores that download > 1 gb after install... presumably this then is a legal thing within limits, but i'm just guessing here...

FourthWorld
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
Posts: 8421
Joined: Sat Apr 08, 2006 7:05 am
Location: Los Angeles
Contact:

Re: Best strategy for building complex software?

Post by FourthWorld » Wed Sep 30, 2020 8:24 pm

SWEdeAndy wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 6:22 pm
I'd like to move more into this kind of approach. But – does Apple approve such apps for the AppStore?
I can't imagine why they wouldn't. Sandboxing applies to the compiled executable, which controls what any scripts running inside it can and can't do. In that sense it's like downloading a spreadsheet with formulas, or a database with triggers, or a lot of other forms of data that may tailor the content and interaction with the user but has no effect on permissions or other restrictions already applied to the executable.
As far as I understand, you could later deliver a completely different 'inside app' from the one Apple reviews.
Yep, and if you sell travel magazines through an app and start distributing porn through it you'll get banned too. Any content, whether images, text, scripts, formulas, etc. should support the good mission of the app as originally approved.
Richard Gaskin
LiveCode Community Liaison

LiveCode development, training, and consulting services: Fourth World Systems
LiveCode Group on Facebook
LiveCode Group on LinkedIn

SWEdeAndy
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
Posts: 61
Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2008 9:48 am
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Contact:

Re: Best strategy for building complex software?

Post by SWEdeAndy » Wed Sep 30, 2020 8:54 pm

FourthWorld wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 8:24 pm
SWEdeAndy wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 6:22 pm
I'd like to move more into this kind of approach. But – does Apple approve such apps for the AppStore?
I can't imagine why they wouldn't. Sandboxing applies to the compiled executable, which controls what any scripts running inside it can and can't do. In that sense it's like downloading a spreadsheet with formulas, or a database with triggers, or a lot of other forms of data that may tailor the content and interaction with the user but has no effect on permissions or other restrictions already applied to the executable.
As far as I understand, you could later deliver a completely different 'inside app' from the one Apple reviews.
Yep, and if you sell travel magazines through an app and start distributing porn through it you'll get banned too. Any content, whether images, text, scripts, formulas, etc. should support the good mission of the app as originally approved.
I totally agree, and Apple should expect as much from the developers. My question was more concerned with this:
I can't imagine why they wouldn't.
Well, I can. Because Apple seems quite suspicions towards people who, like, want to make apps and stuff... :)

So my question could have been more concrete: With your approach, have you had apps rejected/questioned by Apple, due to Apple sensing too much freedom lurking in there...?

But I infer from your answer that you have not. That's good! :)
Andreas Bergendal
Independent app and system developer
WhenInSpace: https://wheninspace.se

FourthWorld
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
Posts: 8421
Joined: Sat Apr 08, 2006 7:05 am
Location: Los Angeles
Contact:

Re: Best strategy for building complex software?

Post by FourthWorld » Wed Sep 30, 2020 9:01 pm

SWEdeAndy wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 8:54 pm
So my question could have been more concrete: With your approach, have you had apps rejected/questioned by Apple, due to Apple sensing too much freedom lurking in there...?
I know a great many people using a wide range of languages, including LC, who deliver apps which can download scripts along with other content.

That said, Apple does reserve the right to enforce existing policies with broad latitude, and to change their policies at any time.
Richard Gaskin
LiveCode Community Liaison

LiveCode development, training, and consulting services: Fourth World Systems
LiveCode Group on Facebook
LiveCode Group on LinkedIn

mimu
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2013 7:00 pm
Location: Berlin
Contact:

Re: Best strategy for building complex software?

Post by mimu » Thu Oct 01, 2020 12:07 pm

Hi stam,
take a look at the Levure-Framework from trevordevore,
In my opinion it‘s perfect to structure a bigger project.
Almost all of your code lives inside scriptonly stacks.
There are a lot of very useful plugins available.
Perfect to use together with git!

stam
Posts: 242
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 9:39 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: Best strategy for building complex software?

Post by stam » Thu Oct 01, 2020 4:26 pm

mimu wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 12:07 pm
Hi stam,
take a look at the Levure-Framework from trevordevore,
In my opinion it‘s perfect to structure a bigger project.
Almost all of your code lives inside scriptonly stacks.
There are a lot of very useful plugins available.
Perfect to use together with git!
That really does look interesting... will definitely give that a serious look. It’s probably quite similar to what I had in mind but seems a lot more polished out of the box. If it’s a good fit will definitely use...

jacque
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
VIP Livecode Opensource Backer
Posts: 5837
Joined: Sat Apr 08, 2006 8:31 pm
Location: Minneapolis MN
Contact:

Re: Best strategy for building complex software?

Post by jacque » Thu Oct 01, 2020 6:49 pm

SWEdeAndy wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 6:22 pm
I'd like to move more into this kind of approach. But – does Apple approve such apps for the AppStore? As far as I understand, you could later deliver a completely different 'inside app' from the one Apple reviews.
Until recently it was a flat-out rejection for the reason you cite. This restriction prevented us from distributing an iOS app in the App Store for 2 years, while the Android version was up and running immediately after submission.

A few months ago Apple began making a distinction between interpreted code and executable code. LC creates interpreted code so if you can show that's the case then you should be fine. I left the project before I was able to test it but that's the word from the LC team.
Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw dot com
HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com

Post Reply

Return to “Getting Started with LiveCode - Experienced Developers”