Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

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mwieder
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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by mwieder » Fri Jul 17, 2020 7:20 am

You seem to be making the case that there's little reason for LiveCode HTML5 to exist.
I'm hard-pressed to argue with that, but if it's gonna be there then maybe there should be an example of it in use. Like maybe something showcased by the mothership to show what can be done.

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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by Lagi Pittas » Fri Jul 17, 2020 2:08 pm

I have to put my Oar in here.

First off - they have a person that looks after the website - he is paid to Market and do the website.

I don't see much of either.

Goto xojo.com and b4x.com these sites are how it should be done.

https://www.xojo.com/
https://www.b4x.com/

B4x has now gone opensource for EVERYTHING except IOS

I don't know how many programmers are in the company but the main programmer/owner of B4X , Erel is on the forums daily actually submitting code - especially for education - which again runs on windows, Mac Linux and android all free to everyone - I have bought licences in the past - at least to support them and play around including the enterprise version with Mac and IOS compilation on windows in the cloud included.

Here is the teaching page written by the lead developer/owner

https://www.b4x.com/teach.html

The forum software they use is much better for what it is used for (code and links at the top)

The platforms deployed to are more than Livecode's and all supported fully, and the examples are many and varied.

Onto our Nemesis XOJO (mwah Hahaha Dun dun Dah! ) - another one I have bought licenses for that when I couldn't get a telephone voice application I was writing to work reliably with Livecode. It was coded and working in XOJO in a day and called it via shell and clipboard commands ). Their documentation, videos, YouTube channel etc are brilliant - they as B4X have staff than livecode but their doc and teaching person Paul Levebre is a one many marketing/website/evangelist typhoon - and he runs his own company on top.


They are soon coming out with their Android addition VERY soon!
https://blog.xojo.com/2020/07/02/andro ... e-reached/

Please Livecode - Kevin - wake up and smell the coffee. I want you to succeed but in my not so humble opinion you seem to be letting your bread and butter Windows/Mac and probably Linux applications fall by the wayside as you add stuff for Filemaker.

I still have 4 computers (all running windows 10) where the IDE 95% of the time can slow to a crawl - 3 seconds per character typed to catch-up.

FIX the bugs and stop adding stuff.

And ichard the reason for eating your own dog food (thats the cleaner way of putting it) is so that you can see what is missing, what doesn't work quite right.

If They had a developer on staff who actually developed for external companies and maybe did a JV so some of the money came to LC they would not be wholly dependent on licences.

Servoy Does it and many other companies.

Microsoft has a team that rights software for outside companies for Microsoft Dynamics (an abomination if there ever was one)

Some of my comments maybe harsh - but it is because I am so frustrated at the way a brilliant product is not getting the polish and bug fixes it deserves. The absolute madness of still not putting a separate license for IOS for Iphone development (yes I know there is community plus) but there are many programmers I know who will not biy a license that runs out after a year - just don't do it. People will upgrade when the extras are deemed worth it. When it comes to IOS - it's everytime Apple decides to change libraries or updates xcode or the OS so there will be a steady flow of income if someone has submitted to the store.

Look at XOJO's pricing.

Better yest look at B4X

https://www.B4x.com


We have lost hermann because he was not being listened to - he was doing what Kevin and steve crighton should be doing - 2000 Widgest (christmas 5 years ago)

What about 3 or 4 years ago the Sqlite stuff with documentastion - the 2d graphics which was in test mode 2 years ago.


I will stop now cos I'm getting angry rather than frustrated - Livecode could have been the best of Delphi and Foxpro combined

I hope the Filemaker stuff is going well because we are going to have another one of these crowdfunding events again in the next 6 months to a year - I hope not because then I will have been right in my prophecy.

Regards Lagi

p.s.

This is out of frustration rather than wanting to cause any offence but fact that they have a person who supposedly looks after the website and we are asking would we fund one is a real joke - what the hell am I missing?

** sorry for the inevitable grammar and smelling pistakes - I have work to do.

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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by bobcole » Fri Jul 17, 2020 4:24 pm

It looks like b4x.com uses WordPress, too.
I think the OP was more interested in the content than the platform.
The website is the face of LiveCode to the web so, it the extent possible, it should be attractive and enticing yet informative. Frankly, I find it quite useful.
Bob

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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by jiml » Fri Jul 17, 2020 4:46 pm

To give an actual answer to OP shaunalan's question - Yes, I would.
But as LiveCode has just completed a successful fundraising campaign they should wait a bit to conduct another.

Re: MarkW's 'eat our own dogfood' post, I wonder if RevIgniter might be useful for that?
I appreciate Mark's metrics on some of their homepage elements, which don't seem to be very optimized for speedy loading.
Every page needs to have that kind of review and then correction, IMO.

The LC team have been amazingly productive given their size and budget.
I am very appreciative of that.

Jim Lambert

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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by jacque » Fri Jul 17, 2020 5:19 pm

do a fund raiser where people who contribute get x-amount of the company.
They do have shareholders. Anyone who is interested can contact them.
Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw dot com
HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com

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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by FourthWorld » Fri Jul 17, 2020 5:23 pm

bobcole wrote:
Fri Jul 17, 2020 4:24 pm
It looks like b4x.com uses WordPress, too.
Yep. It's not the tool, it's how it's used.

And having a web site is not the same as having a content strategy. WP is a fine site building tool, but offers little for content strategy. It's just one small part of a complete communications breakfast.
I think the OP was more interested in the content than the platform.
Hard to say what the OP was interested in, since like so many first-time posters who create an account here only to drop a link to their favorite web site, this one's not returned.
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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by FourthWorld » Fri Jul 17, 2020 5:27 pm

mwieder wrote:
Fri Jul 17, 2020 7:20 am
You seem to be making the case that there's little reason for LiveCode HTML5 to exist.
I've expressed opinions about LC's HTML export, but not in this thread.

As a server-side tool, wouldn't WP be more closely related to LC Server?

Though even there the comparison is apples to oranges; LC Server is more like PHP, which can be used to build things like WP. LC Server can be used to build things like WP too, but it's a lot of work, with low ROI.
I'm hard-pressed to argue with that, but if it's gonna be there then maybe there should be an example of it in use. Like maybe something showcased by the mothership to show what can be done.
Yes to product demos in general. Indeed, I can't recommend any product by any vendor that can't be well demonstrated.

But while a demo of one niche product is useful to include on a site, it's not a good replacement for all the things a good web site needs to accomplish.

And even a good web site is not replacement for a comprehensive content strategy.
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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by richmond62 » Fri Jul 17, 2020 8:47 pm

What specifically would you like to see changed?
Cripes . . .

I now have a sizeable number of kids who have done short LiveCode course with me who have gone onto to learn C++ and C#
at High school and University who ALL have stated that their experience with their LiveCode classes with me has given
them a socking great boost and allowed them to get "down-n'dirty" with the new programming languages very quickly indeed.

Pictures of "pretty" teenage girls at some high school in Edinburgh do NOT let anyone know what a bloody marvellous entry language
LiveCode is (far rather than plastic bath-toys such as Scratch).
-
Girls.jpg
-
Too pretty, too vacant, and too "Aryan".

For all we know these girls may be bloody brilliant with LiveCode: but that picture tells us nothing
and manages to send some negative signals: those girls are stereotypes of spoilt, rich kids.
Last edited by richmond62 on Fri Jul 17, 2020 9:50 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by mwieder » Fri Jul 17, 2020 8:51 pm

Hard to say what the OP was interested in, since like so many first-time posters who create an account here only to drop a link to their favorite web site, this one's not returned.
That's *exactly* the point here.
What about a world where we had a website that didn't send people running away?
...at least the Lego things are gone now.

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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by mwieder » Fri Jul 17, 2020 9:06 pm

What specifically would you like to see changed?
As a positive comment in this thread, for starters I wouldn't at all be opposed to *someone* creating the main site using revIgniter, or hiring Ralf to create it.

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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by JackieBlue1970 » Fri Jul 17, 2020 9:41 pm

Pictures of "pretty" teenage girls at some high school in Edinburgh does NOT let anyone know what a bloody marvellous entry language
LiveCode is
There are lots of languages that could give people a leg up though. I think LiveCode is relatively easy to learn too. But, Python, C#, LIberty Basic, Pure Basic. Not to mention GCC and a plethora of other open source languages. They have their faults but most are cheap/free. You could argue Xojo would be a better learning model than LC just because it is more object oriented, which is the current paradigm in the commercial world.

I understand you are a big fan of LC. I cannot say that I am as a big a fan as you are. However, that doesn't change the possibility that based on their website, lack of funding, and small user base, that they may have some fundamental business and management issues. At some point you have to cut what isn't working and concentrate on the revenue. A good website showcasing their product MIGHT bring in more revenue.

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Re: Would you fund a campaign for a better livecode website?

Post by FourthWorld » Fri Jul 17, 2020 11:41 pm

mwieder wrote:
Fri Jul 17, 2020 8:51 pm
Hard to say what the OP was interested in, since like so many first-time posters who create an account here only to drop a link to their favorite web site, this one's not returned.
That's *exactly* the point here.
What about a world where we had a website that didn't send people running away?
...at least the Lego things are gone now.
I'm not sure my point there was understood. How does your second sentence there relate to my quote above it?

I see a lot of link dropping. All the time. And as the years go by, I see fewer and fewer who ever return to create even just one follow-up post to help us believe the OP was anything more than link spam.

Maybe I'm wrong here. It would be nice to see the exception to the common pattern, with a follow-up post from the OP answering the question I posted to him. Given how much time moderation requires of Klaus and myself, that would be awesome, really. I'm trying to restore my faith in humanity, that maybe there could be more to the Internet than semi-random examples of everything Matt Cutts advises us not to do.
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