Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

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stam
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Location: London, UK

Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by stam » Wed Jul 20, 2022 3:05 pm

Hi all,

has anyone spent some time evaluating the new extensions/plugins from the megabundle? i've encountered several disheartening issues where quality control seems to be lacking to say the least...

The 'old' established plugins like the word file reader work beatifically - no issues. I've used this to import 5,000+ word files seamlessly. Very happy.

However many of the newer offerings are promising but seem quite flawed. Possibly because there is zero documentation on these.
I haven't really had time to document the incorrect behaviour, of which there seem to be many, but to name a few:

responsive layout: the example stack works impressively well. Until you actually try to change settings in the 'magic palette' (if ever there was a dire need of renaming...). Then things go pear-shaped: the buttons in the example stack start overlapping each other inexplicably, one of the two available dropdown menus in the 'magic palette' just disappears etc. The only way to restore is to revert to saved. In fact even the settings don't make much sense to the uninitatied - there is no visual guide to aid those unfamiliar with the plugin.
Doesn't fill me with confidence as a GM killer!

appStarterStack: launching the demo stack actually crashed LC on first launch (with a hang). On subsequent force-quite-and-resrtart and reopening the example stack, it changes my backdrop colour to a gawd-awful red. Unacceptable. But on top of that:
- performance is slow (frame rates of about 10 fps) - on an older mac admittedly but LC works beautifully otherwise
- hovering between the 'navigation layout' buttons the whole screen flickers quite severely (the entire stack becomes a uniform medium-grey for a bout 0.5 seconds) -- just by hovering over the buttons, no clicking
- in the top of the stack there is a left and right arrow button - clicking on these (at least while in the engine info view) immediately crashes liveCode (as in LC immediately crashes and closes).

I think someone else posted about serious issues with polygrid and dataView, but can't seem to find that post now - but certainly in some playing around with these i caused lots of unexpected behaviour which isn't really acceptable.


These should be flagship products selling the new platform! Has anyone else had better results?
S.

heatherlaine
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Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by heatherlaine » Wed Jul 20, 2022 3:42 pm

Hi Stam,

Have you downloaded the very latest bundle.zip file from your account? A large amount of issues have been fixed in the latest bundle. We have been issuing updates to this bundle very rapidly. If you still find issues please report them here:

https://quality.livecode.com/

Please report one issue in each report, this allows us to handle them easily and mark them fixed when they are fixed.

Please note that AppStarterStack is a third party product. I strongly recommend visiting the website:

https://www.appstarterstack.com

where there is a great deal of documentation, including demo videos.

We have begun documenting our new acquisitions in the Enhancements Bundle. Expect many more lessons to appear in the short term, plus blog posts and videos. For now, check here:

https://lessons.livecode.com/m/4071/c/210218

for the latest available lessons.

Best Regards,

Heather

stam
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Location: London, UK

Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by stam » Wed Jul 20, 2022 4:24 pm

Thanks for the response Heather - yes i did download the latest pack before trying as well as the newest version of appStarterStack earlier today before trying these again, thanks to your email which suggested this - and since i weirdly i had time at work as our servers seem to have melted to scrap and nothing is working (must have been the 40 degree heat, or possibly the solar storm yesterday!) I tried these at work (not ideal testing situation but still...).

I'll re-test when i can dedicate more time to this and document specific issues if these are reproducible... This post was just to ask if it's just me or if others have had similar issues.

many thanks
Stam

makeshyft
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Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by makeshyft » Fri Aug 12, 2022 12:14 am

Hi Stam,

Could you please provide me with a video of what you starting an unaltered appstarterstack?

This is the first such report.

The cool think about livecode is that you can run code and change things.

like the very offensive backdrop

if the environment = "development" then
set the backdrop to "140,30,30"
else
set the hidebackdrop to true
end if

If you'd like some help, I'd have to see a video to try to diagnose.

Thanks,

Tom
Founder & Developer @ MakeShyft R.D.A - https://www.makeshyft.com
Build Software with AppStarterStack for Livecode - https://www.AppStarterStack.com
Save Time with The Time Saver's Toolbox - https://www.TimeSaversToolbox.com

makeshyft
Posts: 220
Joined: Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:41 am
Contact:

Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by makeshyft » Fri Aug 12, 2022 12:17 am

Also, the stack is very performant for me ..... and thats pretty visible in the demo video.
Can you tell me the specs of your machine?

Thanks,

Tom
Founder & Developer @ MakeShyft R.D.A - https://www.makeshyft.com
Build Software with AppStarterStack for Livecode - https://www.AppStarterStack.com
Save Time with The Time Saver's Toolbox - https://www.TimeSaversToolbox.com

stam
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Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 9:39 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by stam » Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:09 am

Hi Tom,

my machine is 15' TouchBar MBP (2.7 GHz quad core i7, 16 Gb RAM). Late 2016 model but very fast.
OS: MacOS 12.5 Monterey
LC: 9.6.8 and 10 dp4

I'm not sure now but may have been testing this on an older Mac at the time of my original post, as the battery on the above machine needed replacing - my other machine is an older 15' MBP (2.3 GHz quad core i7 with 16 Gb RAM) running latest version of MacOS Big Sur and latest LC IDE. This machine is quite performant as well, but it is slower on more processor intensive tasks (for example processing 10,000 Word files, extracting and parsing text from these takes around 4-5 mins on my normal machine but > 10 mins on the older machine - but that is the only instance i've seen a noticeable difference in performance).

I haven't had a chance to re-test. Between yet another COVID infection and work i'm behind on everything - to quote Douglas Adams:
“I love deadlines. I love the whooshing noise they make as they go by.”
I'll try to create a video of the issues when i can... will probably need to try on both machines.

BW
S
Last edited by stam on Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

stam
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Location: London, UK

Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by stam » Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:21 am

makeshyft wrote:
Fri Aug 12, 2022 12:14 am
The cool think about livecode is that you can run code and change things.

like the very offensive backdrop

if the environment = "development" then
set the backdrop to "140,30,30"
else
set the hidebackdrop to true
end if

If you'd like some help, I'd have to see a video to try to diagnose.

Thanks,

Tom
The red backdrop seems to be the same as what i've seen in demo videos.

My preference is to have it on and set to a very light shade of blue. I realise i can change this - of course. But the is an environment preference i set in my IDE and any add-on stacks should not be changing my environment at all.

I'll see if i can capture on video when i get a chance...

makeshyft
Posts: 220
Joined: Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:41 am
Contact:

Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by makeshyft » Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:37 am

Hello Stam,

I just did a session with Mark T, and he showed me the stack running on his M1 stack, and it is surprisingly slower than my super average windows machine with a less than average gpu. I'm really not sure why that is the case. Maybe I am using something that is significantly slower on mac than windows. I'm going to work on testing and optimizing the stack better for mac.

Though a couple of the things you mentioned seem quite unnatural and abnormal to what the experience should be.

A video would still help.

Thanks again,

Tom
Founder & Developer @ MakeShyft R.D.A - https://www.makeshyft.com
Build Software with AppStarterStack for Livecode - https://www.AppStarterStack.com
Save Time with The Time Saver's Toolbox - https://www.TimeSaversToolbox.com

stam
Posts: 2633
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 9:39 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by stam » Fri Aug 12, 2022 2:04 am

On a quick test on my faster machine, i don't get the grey flicker that fills the stack, but do get some flicker with the button hilites when hovering from button to button.

video 1: https://share.cleanshot.com/d2yoJg
This video shows:
- the change in backdrop colour
- the (slight) flicker on my faster machine when hovering between buttons
- an extremely annoying thing where launching the stack launches the message box, script editor, message box and project browser in addition to the stack, but the title bar of the latter 4 are all position behind the menubar - too high (although they can just about be grabbed). This serves no purpose but to annoy i'm afraid.
- an annoying 'feature' :
Screenshot 2022-08-12 at 01.52.19.png
closing the stack gives the option of shutting down LC or 'minimising' the stack - but you cannot just close the stack. I'm not sure this is acceptable tbh, i should be able to close whatever stack i want.


Video 2: https://share.cleanshot.com/JyqrGo
This second video shows a crash
this is the debugger info:
crash.jpg
I'll try to find some time to record performance on my older laptop as well...

Stam

stam
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Location: London, UK

Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by stam » Fri Aug 12, 2022 10:23 am

makeshyft wrote:
Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:37 am
I just did a session with Mark T, and he showed me the stack running on his M1 stack, and it is surprisingly slower than my super average windows machine with a less than average gpu. I'm really not sure why that is the case. Maybe I am using something that is significantly slower on mac than windows. I'm going to work on testing and optimizing the stack better for mac.
Hi Tom

i'm not certain but moderately sure graphics behave differently on mac (double buffering or some such?).
Certainly i found that prodigious use of 'lock screen' whenever manipulating graphics fixes almost all graphics issues and removes all flickering in my own apps (on mac).

best regards
Stam

stam
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Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 9:39 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by stam » Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:20 pm

makeshyft wrote:
Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:37 am
A video would still help.
Hi Tom, further to my previous posts, I've tested again on my older MacBook Pro - 2012 15' MBP (2.3 GHz quad core i7 with 16 Gb RAM) running latest version of MacOS Big Sur and latest LC IDE.

Machine speed is seems to be an issue an issue although i've not had any kind of slowdowns running other apps, and my own LC apps run admirably on this machine. You can see in the video below that on hovering over the Engine Info button flickers the entire stack with a grey overlay, not visible really on my faster mac but definitely visible on a slower mac:

Video: https://share.cleanshot.com/rFJgE8

Screenshot:
flicker.jpg
HTH
Stam

stam
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Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 9:39 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by stam » Thu Aug 18, 2022 11:15 am

makeshyft wrote:
Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:37 am
Hello Stam,

I just did a session with Mark T, and he showed me the stack running on his M1 stack, and it is surprisingly slower than my super average windows machine with a less than average gpu. I'm really not sure why that is the case. Maybe I am using something that is significantly slower on mac than windows. I'm going to work on testing and optimizing the stack better for mac.

Though a couple of the things you mentioned seem quite unnatural and abnormal to what the experience should be.

A video would still help.

Thanks again,

Tom
Hi Tom,
As a sidenote i wondered if there was an update to appStarterPack so decided to re-download. However this website is slightly painful:
- there are no downloads in account > downloads section
- in my previous 'purchases' ($0.00 as obtained with megabundle) there is a download link to download my previous 'purchase' but it states i have reached the download limit
- i created a new purchase (again, $0.00 with the megabundle code) and started a download, but this stalled and failed - a problem i had previously with your demo versions ('connection with server is lost' or some such). Actually as yet i have not been able to successfully download the mac demo.
- if i try to re-download the 'new purchase' i am again told i have reached the download limit for the 'purchase'.

I can certainly re-create yet another purchase as with my megabundle code this is free, but what happens if someone has purchased this directly?
Shouldn't the 'purchased' product appear in account > downloads?

bn
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Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by bn » Thu Aug 18, 2022 12:53 pm

Hi Stam,

log into your account at Livecode and look at "Products" -> "Thirdparty". There are the current versions of the megabundle.

Kind regards
Bernd

stam
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Location: London, UK

Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by stam » Thu Aug 18, 2022 2:55 pm

bn wrote:
Thu Aug 18, 2022 12:53 pm
Hi Stam,

log into your account at Livecode and look at "Products" -> "Thirdparty". There are the current versions of the megabundle.

Kind regards
Bernd
Thanks Bernd - but no download link is included there for appStarterStack, just the code and advice to visit the website to 'purchase' it, free of charge with said code...

Having re-read the text there is mention of a GitHub repo - i'm guessing this is a private one that requires a URL to reach, but searching my emails i cannot see i have ever been sent such a URL and cannot see this anywhere in my account at https://www.appstarterstack.com/
I'm hoping Tom can let us know?

bn
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Re: Issues with new plugins/extension from megabundle

Post by bn » Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:33 pm

Hi Stam,

Sorry, I overlooked the AppStarterStack part.

Kind regards
Bernd

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