LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

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townsend
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LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by townsend » Tue Apr 23, 2019 7:15 pm

I have a few questions. I just received an almost unbelievable (email) from "The Livecode Team".
Point and click to create your database and to automatically generate the LiveCode scripts you need.
How much additional work will be required to get this generated code to populate a table?? (An example video would be great.) This 1.2 minute promo video is just too short.

Here's a link to the new LiveCloud.io website. Impressive...
The LiveCloud Docs look to have all the DB features anyone would want.

Note: additional questions to follow.
Last edited by townsend on Wed Apr 24, 2019 4:46 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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Re: LiveCloud.io Bundle Offer (Questions)

Post by bogs » Tue Apr 23, 2019 7:36 pm

Sounds like a pretty incredible deal.
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Re: LiveCloud.io Bundle Offer (Questions)

Post by mtalluto » Tue Apr 23, 2019 8:42 pm

Thank you very much for your feedback. We are very excited to see people trying LiveCloud together. We think LiveCode + LiveCloud is a powerful combo.
1- How much additional work will be required to get this generated code to populate a table?? (An example video would be great.) This 1.2 minute promo video is just too short.
Our code generator will do full CRUD operations. You could use it to get you started with a simple array to create records and thus populate your table.

The sample 'Contacts' app as all the CRUD code in one place so you can see how easy it is to do these basic operations.

We are standing by for your questions to follow. :)
Mark Talluto
--
Canela
http://www.canelasoftware.com
http://www.livecloud.io
http://www.nursenotes.net

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Re: LiveCloud.io Bundle Offer (Questions)

Post by townsend » Wed Apr 24, 2019 12:08 am

3- Since CanelaDB is a NoSQL DB (as opposed to traditional relational database), generally speaking, what would be the difference when accessing records with a typical Header/Detail relationship?

4- I see there is extensive support for defining keys. When doing a Query (read) from the online CanelaDB, is it possible to request a range of records? Ie: between this-date and that-date? Is there any capability to make queries based on wildcards? Full text indexing? Aside from increased speed, what other special features does the CanelaDB offer?

5- I see "Rain" hosting plan supports a 500 MB cloud database and 20 GB blob storage. Does that 500 MB in-memory area just act as a cache for the 20 GB? Or does each table inherently live in one or the other?

6- What about data throughput? Is there a limit on traffic? And if by chance someone needed twice as much storage as the current "Rain" plan offers, would the price be approximately twice as much?

7- I see the "Rain" plan includes 1 Data Region. What exactly is a Data Region? Also, I see there is a CreateProject command. Does this mean data can be segregated between different apps, by defining them each as separate projects?

With live data in the cloud, this makes LiveCode an ideal SAAS platform. (software as a service)

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Re: LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by mtalluto » Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:35 pm

3- Since CanelaDB is a NoSQL DB (as opposed to traditional relational database), generally speaking, what would be the difference when accessing records with a typical Header/Detail relationship?
If I understand correctly, you are asking how to work with a data-model where you have a one to many relationships. You could denormalize your data and consider each record to be a document. All data related to the header would then be found in the single record. Or, you could build two tables and have a foreign key to connect the two tables together. This is managed manually on your code side. We currently do this in NurseNotes (one of the apps we make). If I totally missed your question, please let me know.
4- I see there is extensive support for defining keys. When doing a Query (read) from the online CanelaDB, is it possible to request a range of records? Ie: between this-date and that-date?
Yes on date ranges. More query range support could be added. We are interested in feedback that will help developers get their work done faster.
Is there any capability to make queries based on wildcards?
Yes. LiveCode's filter is used internally.
Full text indexing?
Please elaborate on this. :)
Aside from increased speed, what other special features does the CanelaDB offer?
One of the most important is that your code-base works in either local or cloud with a single argument change. Another is that it fully utilizes arrays. You can even store arrays in keys. The library is very light in terms of memory. We update it often. So, you always have access to the latest version. CanelaDB deals well when the internet goes offline. Key outgoing traffic is automatically cached for you and sent when the internet returns. Encryption and authentication are built-in. So, you can subtract those from your workload. We also have built-in user support. This is automatically tied to the authentication features. We are working on adding roles and privileges. More details can be found here: https://livecloud.io/features/

5- I see "Rain" hosting plan supports a 500 MB cloud database and 20 GB blob storage. Does that 500 MB in-memory area just act as a cache for the 20 GB? Or does each table inherently live in one or the other?
The in-memory allocation is 500 MB. This is the amount of space allotted to the 'Rain' account for queryable data. This space may be spread out over different instances on different servers in a given region. The 20 GB of blob space is stored differently. We use the Digital Ocean Spaces object storage for this feature. This data is not queriable. It is useful for large chunks of data like pictures, video, PDF, etc.

6- What about data throughput? Is there a limit on traffic?
The 'Rain' tier is a shared environment in terms of resources. The more developers that use the service the more resources we will have to share within a given region. The service automatically monitors the health of each region. When resource usage increases, droplets are spun up and added to the region. As we add droplets to support a region, your data will be partitioned across the instances available. This will allow for a certain amount of disproportionate spiking by a range of accounts.

We are not limiting by traffic for the time being. We are making a big effort to simplify the metrics used for billing. Pricing based on RAM usage is a good place for us to start. Should a particular account need a regular and disproportionate quantity of bandwidth, we are happy to notify them and discuss their options. We have a 'Storm' tier available where an account can customize their private region. A team will be assigned to work closely with the LiveCloud developer/s to determine the best architecture to support their needs.
And if by chance someone needed twice as much storage as the current "Rain" plan offers, would the price be approximately twice as much?
Yes, the pricing is linear. Double the memory used should generate a bill very close to 2 x $15.
7- I see the "Rain" plan includes 1 Data Region. What exactly is a Data Region?
A region is defined by the geographic locations where Digital Ocean has placed their datacenters. Their regions are located near the bottom of their homepage https://www.digitalocean.com. This will allow a developer to pick the best geographic region to support its customers.

Also, I see there is a CreateProject command. Does this mean data can be segregated between different apps, by defining them each as separate projects?
Yes and yes.
Mark Talluto
--
Canela
http://www.canelasoftware.com
http://www.livecloud.io
http://www.nursenotes.net

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Re: LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by townsend » Thu Apr 25, 2019 1:37 am

Mark: Great answer on question 3: Header/Detail Options. I'm very excited about the scalability of the NoSQL model. And especially the built in user authentication. Suddenly this opens up a new world of possibilities.
More query range support could be added.
8- Exactly what field types are supported? I read somewhere that NoSQL databases allow the user to define field types. Is this required? How does that work? I see you use the CouchDB logo on your site. Is CanelaDB a subset of CouchDB?
The in-memory allocation is 500 MB. This is the amount of space allotted to the 'Rain' account for queryable data. This space may be spread out over different instances on different servers in a given region. The 20 GB of blob space is stored differently. We use the Digital Ocean Spaces object storage for this feature. This data is not queryable. It is useful for large chunks of data like pictures, video, PDF, etc.
9- Interesting. Would the address of the blob object, then be stored in memory, as a field in a table? Would this be an internal address or a public URL? Does this mean that all the contents of all tables that have keys, must be stored in the 500 MB area?

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Re: LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by mtalluto » Fri Apr 26, 2019 6:48 pm

This 1.2 minute promo video is just too short.
More videos are being created this week. They will cover a number of topics.
Mark Talluto
--
Canela
http://www.canelasoftware.com
http://www.livecloud.io
http://www.nursenotes.net

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Re: LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by mtalluto » Fri Apr 26, 2019 7:06 pm

8- Exactly what field types are supported? I read somewhere that NoSQL databases allow the user to define field types. Is this required? How does that work? I see you use the CouchDB logo on your site. Is CanelaDB a subset of CouchDB?
The fields in CanelaDB are not typed. They are strings. Thus, you can store strings and binary data as values in any key. CanelaDB is 100% built in LiveCode. It is basically a monster array machine. It is a testament to what can be built with LiveCode.

The various logos are meant to represent that you get many of the benefits of each of those technologies in one simple to use LiveCode library.

9- Interesting. Would the address of the blob object, then be stored in memory, as a field in a table? Would this be an internal address or a public URL? Does this mean that all the contents of all tables that have keys, must be stored in the 500 MB area?
I recently wrote how this works on our forums. You can view this here: https://forums.livecloud.io/showthread.php?tid=7
Mark Talluto
--
Canela
http://www.canelasoftware.com
http://www.livecloud.io
http://www.nursenotes.net

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Re: LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by gagsoft » Sun May 19, 2019 12:59 pm

I am highly exited plus bit concerned at the same time.
After purchasing the LiveCloud 9 and LiveCloud 1 yr subscription from the latest promo,
I only received a confirmation email from PayPal.

Would really appreciate it if anybody could shed some light on this as I do not know what my next step should be.

best
Peter
Last edited by gagsoft on Sun May 19, 2019 1:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by Klaus » Sun May 19, 2019 1:25 pm

Hi Peter,

today is also sunday in Scotland, so you should give them at least one day to answer. :D


Best

Klaus

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Re: LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by gagsoft » Sun May 19, 2019 1:27 pm

I wonder if there are any vacancies. :D


Thanks

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Re: LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by bogs » Sun May 19, 2019 1:34 pm

Only between my ears...
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Re: LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by mtalluto » Sun May 19, 2019 5:11 pm

gagsoft wrote:
Sun May 19, 2019 12:59 pm
I am highly exited plus bit concerned at the same time.
After purchasing the LiveCloud 9 and LiveCloud 1 yr subscription from the latest promo,
I only received a confirmation email from PayPal.

Would really appreciate it if anybody could shed some light on this as I do not know what my next step should be.

best
Peter

Hello Peter,

Most of the LiveCode team is at the LiveCode conference in San Jose. Most of the Canela team is here too. I am happy to help you get started. You should have received a promo code that can be used to provide you your free year to LiveCloud. You can download the LiveCloud Manager app from https://livecloud.io/get-started/

When you create your account, there will be a field for your code. Please let me know if you have any other questions.
Mark Talluto
--
Canela
http://www.canelasoftware.com
http://www.livecloud.io
http://www.nursenotes.net

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Re: LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by Klaus » Sun May 19, 2019 5:22 pm

Ah, yes, it is conference time!

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Re: LiveCloud.io Cloud DB (Questions)

Post by mtalluto » Sun May 19, 2019 7:12 pm

I wish you were here Klaus. I have a beer with your name on it from many years ago. Not to worry, I will get you a fresh one when we next see each other. :D
Mark Talluto
--
Canela
http://www.canelasoftware.com
http://www.livecloud.io
http://www.nursenotes.net

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