Is that the end of SuperCard?

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richmond62
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Is that the end of SuperCard?

Post by richmond62 » Thu Jul 02, 2020 4:45 pm

https://supercard.us/supercard-in-parallels.html

"SuperCard 4.8.1 remains 32-bit. Unfortunately, producing a 64-bit version of SuperCard requires a complete rewrite of the software as Apple has gone back on their promise to deliver 64-bit Carbon frameworks. This is a tremendous undertaking, and while the current version has made some inroads in this regard, currently it is unknown how long it will take or if it is even possible."

Emphasis is mine.

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Re: Is that the end of SuperCard?

Post by mwieder » Thu Jul 02, 2020 8:20 pm

Yep - that's my reading. LiveCode made the decision some time back to rewrite the OSX underpinnings from Carbon to Cocoa and thus future-proof the environment for 64-bit operating systems. Carbon was only supposed to be a compatibility bridge from older OS8 and OS9 programs into OSX in the first place, and it's been deprecated since OSX 10.8. SuperCard has had eight years to bring things up to date. "unknown how long it will takes" translates to "gee... we haven't thought about that yet".

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Re: Is that the end of SuperCard?

Post by FourthWorld » Thu Jul 02, 2020 8:24 pm

mwieder wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 8:20 pm
"unknown how long it will takes" translates to "gee... we haven't thought about that yet".
Careful there. SC's lead engineer, Mark Lucas, is a long-time friend of mine. He's thought about it. And then some. I could fill volumes with just the corners I know about his work to keep updating SC. But with the history of the code base it's not a simple task.
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Re: Is that the end of SuperCard?

Post by mwieder » Thu Jul 02, 2020 8:33 pm

Could say the same about LiveCode's engine source. It takes will to make a massive change like that. LiveCode's team made the effort. Yes, SuperCard can run in Parallels in 32-bit mode, but that doesn't help deliver 64-bit apps.

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Re: Is that the end of SuperCard?

Post by mwieder » Thu Jul 02, 2020 8:37 pm

Update:"we haven't thought about that" was a bit harsh, yes. I obviously don't know SuperCard's code base. But complaining about being blindsided by Apple now after the horse has already left the stall, when they've had years to gear up for this seems a bit disingenuous.

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Re: Is that the end of SuperCard?

Post by FourthWorld » Thu Jul 02, 2020 8:45 pm

The didn't say "Apple never said they were going to 64-bit". What they wrote is "Apple has gone back on their promise to deliver 64-bit Carbon frameworks." There may be details behind that I'm not aware of.

Rather than get all judgy about them when I don't have the information they have, it's easier for me to just wish them the best and go back to my own work...
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Re: Is that the end of SuperCard?

Post by mwieder » Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:25 pm

True. Not getting judgy here, I do wish there were a good alternative to LiveCode out there, just to hedge bets. One thing I learned early on in doing hardware designs is "never use single-source components".

But if SuperCard can't build 64-bit applications, who's going to keep using it? Maybe they should enter into a licensing agreement for the LC engine... that sounds like it could be a win for everyone.

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Re: Is that the end of SuperCard?

Post by richmond62 » Fri Jul 03, 2020 7:43 am

I don't know about hedging bets, but I do know that anything without a viable competitor
is likely to become complacent or slipshod sooner or later.

A competitor that is close to LiveCode in the way SuperCard is to an extent is a healthy sort
of thing to keep LiveCode on its collective toes.

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Re: Is that the end of SuperCard?

Post by FourthWorld » Fri Jul 03, 2020 8:10 am

SC's a competitor only for Mac-exclusive devs. Its key value is in being focused on Mac, while LC's main value is running everywhere.

I love SC, but I have work on Windows and fun on Linux so there's not as much there for me these days.
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