Serfing USA

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richmond62
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Serfing USA

Post by richmond62 » Mon Nov 25, 2019 7:56 pm

Serf.png
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https://web.archive.org/web/20000822032 ... com/~serf/
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You will need:

1. A Macintosh computer capable of running MacOS 7-9, or

2. A Macintosh computer (PPC) capable of running 'Classic'. or

3. A way to emulate MacOS 7-9

"It's everything you want!
For all developers from little to big, Serf is the ultimate answer. Serf supports integrated color, threading, object-oriented classes, and much more. With Serf, you don't need to give up your investment in your scripting language, and you don't need to learn new techniques and behaviors unless you want to. Serf will give you the capability to expand your scripting efforts. And the documentation is built right into the application!

It's everything you remember!

SerfTalk, the scripting language of Serf, is a superset of xTalk. You'll be able to use HyperTalk, SuperTalk, and MetaTalk scripts with almost no modifications -- it's quite compatible. It also contains new improvements, such as the apostrophe-s 'reverse of': button 1's hilite is the same as hilite of button 1 . Referring to objects is much more flexible and English-like. You can say third checkbox, or 3rd checkbox, or even (x)th checkbox! How about the first line of card #4's (x+1)th field part's contents...?

It's everything you need!

Serf has a compiled frontend coupled with an interpreted backend for especially fast execution on machines with slow or no cache (between 3x and 10x the performance of HyperTalk). As Serf matures, it will get even faster than that. Serf graphic

Serf is entirely object-oriented and supports Classes. A Class is simply a cleverly written piece of script which does the most important work for an object, such as drawing it and deciding what happens when it's clicked, all out of sight. Three commonly used classes are the 'Button', 'Field', and 'Window' classes. But there are plenty more, such as sliders, graphics, and movies. Some Classes can also be "sub-classes" of other classes. For example, in HyperCard a checkbox is a button. In Serf, a Checkbox is a subclass of a Button. You can use the script "tenth button" to get the tenth button of any kind, or you can refer to a specific checkbox as "tenth checkbox part", in which case it finds the tenth button that is specifically a checkbox. Object-oriented programming can be as simple as that. Many of the standard Serf objects are subclasses, which helps compatibility with xtalk development environments.

Fields are extremely robust, offering color, tabbing, very large amounts of text, Macintosh Drag-and-drop, and more. All of the user interface utilizes the "OS 8" look, including three types of bevel buttons. Serf is OS-8 savvy, and it even runs speedily on machines with only System 7 and older PowerPC chips.

It's everything you can't afford to be without!

Serf has a Tool Palette and Message Box for fast access to your windows and handlers. Instead of putting up dialog boxes at every turn, you can change options while you work through a sophisticated yet simple Part Information window. This palette is space-efficient and fits in any closet or underneath the bed. A 640x480 screen is sufficient to use Serf; anything larger is nice but not required."

bogs
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Re: Serfing USA

Post by bogs » Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:06 pm

richmond62 wrote:
Mon Nov 25, 2019 7:56 pm
It's everything you need!
Archived Serf Site wrote:At the time of this writing (September 1999), the PC version of Serf looks to be at least three months away,
Erm...
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richmond62
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Re: Serfing USA

Post by richmond62 » Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:27 pm

Ha, Ha, Ha: I knew I'd "get you" bogs. 8)

Dan Gelder gave the whole thing up about 5 minutes after stating that for
some unknown reason.

What interests me are some of his comments in that text; especially about
his having increased the flexibility of xTalk.

It makes me very pleased, however, that I managed to track SERF down,
having lost my ZIP disk with it on about 19 years ago.

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Re: Serfing USA

Post by richmond62 » Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:42 pm

Currently running SERF on a G5 iMac running 'Classic' under MacOS 10.4.11.

I was a very lucky chap as I was able to lay my hands on a delightful series of PolyCarbonate iMacs:

1. G5 iMac

2.32-bit Intel iMac

3.64-bit iMac

for the princely sum of 25 Euros each.

Actually I was lucky: the bloke had six of the things: so now I have
2 of each. :D

Although, as I am going to do a series of guest lectures at the University on xTalk langauges
I shall load HyperCard and SERF onto my G4 Mac Mini that also runs 'Classic' under MacOS 10.4.11.
so I can just bung the thing in my "handbag" rather than lug a polycarbonate iMac over there
( heavy [25 lb / 11 kg] and with rather unpleasant sharp undersides).

Oooo: just found out that it is possible to run Windows 10 on the Intel ones . . . I wonder . . .
Last edited by richmond62 on Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

bogs
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Re: Serfing USA

Post by bogs » Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:45 pm

Heh, congrats!

I'm still looking into the SK8 source code. Mac LISP is *not* exactly like every other LISP out there (but then, neither is every other *LISP*) :?

However, there is a great deal I have to change / swap out / just plain delete before I can even see if I can get it to run on anything other than OS9 :|
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richmond62
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Re: Serfing USA

Post by richmond62 » Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:50 pm

"a version of HyperCard's HyperTalk programming language"
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sk8_1.jpg
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sk8_2.jpg
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Do you have access to a machine that can run Mac OS 9?

Here's a link to the compiled thing rather than just the source code:

https://www.macintoshrepository.org/2625-apple-sk8

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Re: Serfing USA

Post by bogs » Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:12 pm

I did actually have a vm running OS7-9, but changed out my hardrives for my school work and it didn't make the jump. I'll see if I can get something going again though heh.

Thanks for the link, I was having some issues getting MacLisp 4 to compile the source :wink:
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richmond62
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Re: Serfing USA

Post by richmond62 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:17 pm

I do recommend, bogs, that you get your paws on some original hardware.

If, as I suspect, you are "getting all kinky" about the huge amount
of work that was going on at Apple, then suddenly dropped when 'Prince Steve' returned
after the Gil Amelio patch, bearing NeXT with him and Copland and so on went
down the pan. you really need to make this:

https://macintoshgarden.org/

your spiritual home . . .

It does seem sad that when Apple abandoned their original OS
and began working on a front-end floating on UNIX
(something utterly hilarious considering the years and years they had
been banging on about Windows being something floating on DOS) so
much work "went for nowt."

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Re: Serfing USA

Post by richmond62 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:22 pm


richmond62
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Re: Serfing USA

Post by richmond62 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:58 pm

SK8 does NOT seem to run in the 'Classic' layer on a PPC machine running MacOS 10.4.

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Re: Serfing USA

Post by FourthWorld » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:52 pm

SK8's pretty old tech. I wonder if there's anything in it we couldn't build in LC.
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Re: Serfing USA

Post by richmond62 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:34 pm

Picture 3.png
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Getting back to SERF, I must say I do like the Properties Palette, which
was, at the time, pretty comprehensive.

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Re: Serfing USA

Post by richmond62 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:38 pm

SK8's pretty old tech. I wonder if there's anything in it we couldn't build in LC.
I'm absolutely sure we could build quite a lot more in LiveCode than we could
build in SK8, but I have a feeling that while bogs' world and yours FourthWorld
may overlap they don't entirely coincide. 8)

This thread is in the Off-Topic department for a good reason. :D

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Re: Serfing USA

Post by FourthWorld » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:42 pm

richmond62 wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:38 pm
SK8's pretty old tech. I wonder if there's anything in it we couldn't build in LC.
I'm absolutely sure we could build quite a lot more in LiveCode than we could
build in SK8, but I have a feeling that while bogs' world and yours FourthWorld
may overlap they don't entirely coincide. 8)
I don't understand what that means.

If there's something interesting in SK8, why not enjoy it on modern hardware?
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Re: Serfing USA

Post by richmond62 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:47 pm

Well, Yes.

But just at the moment, I, at least, am enjoying SERF on 14 year old hardware,
rather in the same way I enjoy my lunch breaks at my school messing around with
BBC BASIC on my 1981 BBC MODEL B computer.

Do you think it is possible that there might be other people "out there" who also
enjoy that sort of thing?

Possibly not everyone is entirely convinced of the "ever upwards" mentality
and can see some virtues of retaining some things that are good.

https://stardot.org.uk/forums/index.php
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