Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

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Simon Knight
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Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

Post by Simon Knight » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:55 pm

Hi,

While I have used Livecode for years I have no experience of using it with the internet running on a server. So please be gentle!

I have decided to create a web site and I would like to offer viewers the ability to add their own comments. I have a simple web design tool called RapidWeaver that allows me to design the basic pages but I believe that the standard method of adding reader comments is to use an external service such as Muut. The basic version of Muut (and others) is free but it starts to cost once additional features are needed. So my question is could Livecode be used to manage user comments ? If yes then has it already been done and where should I direct my research?

Thanks

Simon
best wishes
Skids

bogs
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Re: Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

Post by bogs » Tue Dec 04, 2018 2:16 pm

Something came up a little earlier this year that *sounds* like what your asking about, though I don't know the limitations that will eventually be hit. The thread was talking about taking users comments and placing them in a field, separating the comments, etc.

I believe the thread started using a Datagrid, but I, Jacque, and others suggested a simple text field. Unfortunately, I seem to have lost track of the thread and author, I seem to want to say it was ajperks, but my memory just isn't up to it at the moment.
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Simon Knight
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Re: Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

Post by Simon Knight » Tue Dec 04, 2018 5:32 pm

Hi,
Thanks for the steer. I think it may have been this thread : viewtopic.php?f=9&t=28420&p=149059#p149059

Its not quite what I was asking about but it does describe an interesting idea which could be used to bypass HTML altogether although I do suspect that getting it through the Apple approval system would be an issue.
best wishes
Skids

FourthWorld
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Re: Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

Post by FourthWorld » Tue Dec 04, 2018 6:10 pm

Doable, but a lot of work. Even before you set up the commenting DB you'll need to craft an account management system, with password recovery and such. Each bit isn't that hard to do, but there's a lot that goes into something like that. And that's just before you get to the security side of things. Yesterday's news about Quora shows just how difficult it is: they're one of the biggest, well funded, and got hacked.

I've been on the fence about this myself, whether to roll my own or use an existing service. In my case I have multiple uses for the various components, and have been working in this field for several years, so I'm leaning toward roll-my-own, left now with the challenge of self-financing the considerable development involved.

For most folks using one of the free commenting services will get the feature in place nearly instantly, and let you get back to focusing on the bigger task of marketing your new community.

The ones listed here are all free:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blog_comm ... ng_service
Richard Gaskin
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bogs
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Re: Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

Post by bogs » Wed Dec 05, 2018 12:11 am

Simon Knight wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 5:32 pm
Hi,
Thanks for the steer. I think it may have been this thread : viewtopic.php?f=9&t=28420&p=149059#p149059
That topic was a close second to the one I was thinking of. Sure wish my memory was better :oops:

In any case, Richard has said what I would have added myself, what your contemplating is an unusually large project *just* to get to the scope you would have with one of the free solutions available.

It is something to consider.
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Simon Knight
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Re: Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

Post by Simon Knight » Thu Dec 06, 2018 9:04 am

Hi,

Thank you for your comments; I have decided to heed the advice and look for a solution that is already available as creating my own is a much more challenging task than I first anticipated.

best wishes

Simon
best wishes
Skids

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Re: Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

Post by FourthWorld » Thu Dec 06, 2018 9:55 am

Didn't mean to scare you away from the task; it can be a fun exercise. But if you need to deploy on a deadline there is indeed a lot to learn.

Going with a third party solution will save you a lot of time. But if you later want to resume researching a custom solution, the latest book by my friend Kyle Rankin will provide a great start:

Linux Hardening in Hostile Networks: Server Security from TLS to Tor
https://www.amazon.com/Linux-Hardening- ... 0134173260
Richard Gaskin
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bogs
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Re: Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

Post by bogs » Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:34 am

And since I am essentially housebound at the moment, I went looking for (but didn't find yet) the thread I was talking about. However, I *did* find this thread, which may help somewhat to give you a basic outline for a db based chat.

The thread I am thinking of, though, didn't require a db per se I don't think. Still looking for that thread :roll:

*Edit - AHA! I found it, and figured out why I couldn't find it originally :oops:
The thread was this one: unicode ?

The parts pertinent to creating a website based message system should be relatively easy to see. The title of the thread is why I couldn't associate it with what I was thinking of :roll:

A number of ajperks other posts also concern this topic, and give different solutions to various problems your likely to come up against.
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Simon Knight
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Re: Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

Post by Simon Knight » Thu Dec 06, 2018 9:06 pm

Hi both,

I shall probably try a two pronged approach, initially use a third party tool (either Disqus or MyBB) while seeing if a Livecode/PostGreSql DB I wrote for a LAN can be bent to the task. The db had passwords that were only stored in MD5 format which seemed to stop teenagers hacking the tool but probably won't keep out really dedicated hackers. There again I don't think anyone will put much time and effort into hacking the small web site that I have planned.

I'll look at the book and the links to the threads - many thanks.

Simon
best wishes
Skids

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Re: Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

Post by FourthWorld » Thu Dec 06, 2018 9:22 pm

Worth considering when building out any server: aside from large databases of credit card info, almost no one has any data any hacker wants.

But they do want do hack your site.

Why?

They don't want your data. They want your computer resources.

Sometimes for mining Bitcoin. Sometimes for installing spam relays. All sorts of things.

If they find interesting data along the way that's just extra bonus points.

This is problematic for the industry as a whole, because it means that small systems need nearly the same level of hardening and monitoring as big systems.

In the olden days it was enough to deliver a system that worked. But today, even seemingly trivial apps, if they use a server, require additional effort to be made and maintained securely.

So along with the inevitable changes in UI conventions from OS vendors, new LC features, and new customer expectations from an ever-changing business climate, we also need to add security to our ongoing studies.

Fortunately it's not quite as daunting as it may seem at first. There are plenty of good materials to learn from, many of them free.
Richard Gaskin
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SparkOut
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Re: Creating forum/comment web pages using Livecode

Post by SparkOut » Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:08 pm

FourthWorld wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 9:22 pm
... require additional effort to be made and maintained securely.
...
that is also very pertinent. You cannot just "set and forget" and must continually review to ensure there are no new exposures of vulnerabilities.
Which is another reason why the exercise is a great idea from a learning perspective but given that OSS offerings are likely better supported and more fully featured that you can manage as a solo effort, it is probably safer to look at those offerings for the public facing site.

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